Episode 276: The Rare Plant Scout

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Transcript

[0:00] Music.

Jane Perrone [0:16]

Welcome to On The Ledge, the podcast that puts houseplants under the spotlight and only freaks out just a little bit when they turn out to have spider mites.

[0:25] Music.

[0:33] I am your host, Jane Perrone, and in this week's show, I find out about a job that I think we'd all like to have. That's rare plant scouting. I chat to rare plant scout Jazminn Williams to find out more and to get her top tips on how to avoid disaster when you buy plants from overseas. Plus, I answer a question about what I consider to be the world's worst houseplant. Hmm, intriguing. My interview with Jazminn Williams, the rare plant scout coming up very shortly, but just first to say something very important, which is my new thing. I can't exactly call it a book because it's not quite a book. Houseplant Gardener in a Box is now out in the UK. It came out on the 11th of October, 2023, and it's going to be available in North America from the 24th of October. So this is very exciting. It's a set of 60 houseplant cards. Each one has a gorgeous illustration and on the other side some text written by me with loads of nuggets of great information about how to take care of your plants. Plus there's a booklet in the box as well which has got everything from buying plants to choosing the right plants for your home and its individual rooms. And it's really exciting because I think this is a lovely thing that you're going to love to own or maybe buy as a gift for somebody because it's very beautifully boxed and presented. So if you want to find out more about Houseplant Gardener in a Box, visit the website, janeperrone.com, and you'll find all of the info you need there. And I'd love to know what you think of it.

[2:22] Now onto my chat with Jazminn and if you've ever lusted after a wishlist plant but just despaired that you can't find it anywhere or been terrified of ordering from an online seller whose plant seems too good to be true, this is the episode for you. I'm sure you're going to enjoy this interview with Jazminn where we get into the nitty-gritty of tracking down rare plants and how to keep yourself safe and solvent when you're buying plants long distance.

Jazminn Williams

My name is Jazminn Williams. I am the owner and founder of the Rare Plant Scout. So I am an avid plant collector and enthusiast. I collect mainly rare plants, aroids in particular, and I also source these plants for people predominantly around the UK.

Jane Perrone

Sounds like a fun job. I mean, that's everyone's dream, isn't it Jazminn? A bit like going to hunt out interesting plants and you are doing that for other people as well. That sounds really fun. What does that actually entail?

Jazminn Williams

So as a rare plant scout, I source plants for people, like I said, predominantly in the UK, so my clients and customers will reach out for me and they'll ask me to find a specific, species for them. Sometimes it might be like a Monstera alba, which is quite a generic plant in the UK now or a type of philodendron and this is predominantly because.

[3:51] They either can't find it themselves or they're a little bit worried about getting it online, so they will reach out to me on my social networks or through my website and they'll ask me, whether I can source this plant have I ever seen it before on the odd occasion they might ask me for a plant I've never even heard of and that is fantastic because it means I really have to delve down a rabbit hole to try and find this really special plant. I'm really lucky because I've been doing this for such a long time. I have a really exclusive international network of people that I can reach out to to help me source these plants sustainably for my customers.

Jane Perrone [4:27]

Because I guess that's the idea in our heads that you think, well, it's the era of the internet. Anyone can find anything, but I'm sure that's not the case and you have connections beyond Google to find this stuff. I'm obviously not going to ask you to reveal your sources, but I'd be interested to know what kind of things you're being asked to source right now. Are we still in the era of those rare aroids being top of the tree or is there something else that's coming up and you're seeing more and more people ask for?

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, so 99% of the plants I'm asked to source are rare aroids, predominantly from personal collectors. I also get asked on the odd occasion for garden plants and I have been asked a time or two for plants for scientific research, so that usually goes out of the aroid area. But most of the requests that I've seen are genuses from both the Monstera and the Philodendrons a lot of variegation. So I think rare aroids are still very top of the table, especially for myself looking for plants. And from what I've experienced, I don't think arrows will be replaced anytime soon, you know, especially with tissue cultures and plants going through that kind of technique to get some of the more rarer plants more obtainable and affordable for people, I think they're still up there on people's top of their lists.

Jane Perrone [5:46]

I guess you're seeing the list change as things become more widely available. Like as you said, Monstera Albo, probably maybe that was something you were being asked for a lot two years ago, but maybe not so much now. Is there anything right now that everyone's asking for and you just can't - at the moment it's just not available? Or what's the kind of hot button plant right now?

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, so I've quite recently been asked for an Anthurium 'Delta Force'. Now this is a hybrid which has been around for quite a long time, but even though the mother plants have been bred multiple times, it's really hard to get the same morphology as the 'Delta Force', as the true 'Delta Force'. It's absolutely stunning plant, but it's still worth, you know, £8,000 for a plant. So that's the sort of thing which, until it goes into tissue culture or until it becomes widely available and more people start propagating it, it's just so hard to obtain.

Jane Perrone

Describe 'Delta Force' for me. What's so special about it? What does it look like?

Jazminn Williams

So, anthuriums as a whole usually have quite big lobes, which looks like ears on the top of the leaves. So, for a Delta Force in its mature form, it's quite triangular. So, the lobes flatten out on the top. So, it looks like it has a triangular morphology. It has really quite prominent veins. And very dark leaves. Absolutely beautiful. You should definitely look it up.

Jane Perrone

Okay, I think I've, yeah, I think I've seen this somewhere or other. It's definitely come past my eyes at some point on probably on Instagram. But I mean, and it's a cool name as well. Sometimes, is that a factor? Am I being terribly shallow? Do you think that makes a difference?

Jazminn Williams

No, I think it does make a difference. There was a big thing with pink princesses a little while back and a new variant came out with with higher variegation. It was called a pink princess galaxy or marble. And as soon as that name changed, and as soon as you could see a little bit more variegation that was speckled on there. A lot of people then wanted that plant. and unfortunately, there is a lot of mislabeling with that, because people want to sell the plant for more money. But yeah, I think names really do make a difference when it comes to buying plants.

Jane Perrone

Yeah, I always remember talking to a seed, a vegetable seed catalogue, and them saying, you know, it really makes a difference. The name, you know, we've changed the name of something. And you know, sales went up from literally nothing to like went up 500% just because they changed the name to something a bit more. I think it was a lettuce and you know, people just are really into a good name. And I'm certainly one of those people. I remember there's a lettuce called 'Drunken Woman'. And I just thought, I've got to have that lettuce, right? I'm sure it's the same with houseplants. So what is it that makes people come to you rather than trying to source things on their own?

Jazminn Williams

So I think it can be quite difficult and very daunting to source plants. Especially if you're looking for something really expensive or you're inexperienced in the areas, there are just so many places to look. So some of the biggest platform for plants in the UK is like Etsy or eBay, or you can go on social media for Instagram and Facebook. You know, where these plants probably quite easy to source, reasonably priced, and you can get a good deal, but you're also risking getting a plant which might be, you know, pest damaged. It could be diseased. It could have all of these problems. And unless you know what you're looking for, especially if you're spending a lot of money, you could end up being ripped off. And I think for a lot of people, that's really, really frightening. And then on the other side of it, if you go to a plant shop that you know is really well-established, you're gonna be paying quite a heavy price tag to get those plants. And they don't usually have the large variety that people are looking for of that specific plant. So I think coming to a plant scout, coming to me, it means that you know exactly what you want. You can say, I want X plant. I want it to be this size and this is my budget. Then I can just go off into the ether, do my little researching and come back with all these options, which are within those parameters, if it is possible.

Jane Perrone

There must be occasions where you just go, I'm sorry, I just can't get that plant. There must be some things that just right now, even you are foiled.

Jazminn Williams [9:55]

I think a big thing it comes down to is usually budgets.You know, if someone asks for like a variegated gloriosum and they're going to give me a really low budget, I can't work with that. And there are also plants which are really hard to source. A lot of Alocasia are really difficult to ship because they're really unstable. So that's one of the species of plants that I find quite difficult to obtain for people. I usually have to get them within Europe or the UK, which can take a little bit longer.

Jane Perrone

You've found the plant, do you then arrange for that to go straight to the buyer? Presumably, you're using your expertise then to guarantee or to, as much as you can, know that the plant's going to turn up in good condition and isn't going to suffer from being stuck in customs, because that's the other big fear, isn't it?

Jazminn Williams

Yeah. I actually get all of my plants that I pre-order or have been scouted to my house or to my my shop and I will look after those. So I acclimate plants for three to four weeks. I make sure that they have no pest damage, that they have no root rot, that they're healthy and ready to be shipped on. And I do this because, you know, someone's a little bit inexperienced, or even if they just don't have the time to look after their plants in the way that they really should with an import, when they get back, if it dies, or if it's been sent in bad condition, that's not really something that I want to be a part of. I want people to receive plants that are beautiful, that will thrive in their care. So I'd rather put a little bit of extra time in to make sure that it's nice for them. And if it arrives to me and it's not in the best condition or it could be a little bit better or if it has had an issue in customs and unfortunately it's not arrived to me very well, I will then either refund that customer or I'll get another plant sent out for them so then they can still have the plant they've looked for.

Jane Perrone [11:45]

Yeah, that sounds very reassuring. I guess for some people, you know, I mean, I'm guessing your customers are probably time hungry, but not necessarily, you know, have a larger budget and, you know, they can't spend the time spending months trying to find these plants, but they can get you on board to actually source a plant and that saves a lot of stress. I guess that's what you're offering.

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, exactly. And, you know, I've been very fortunate and I've been very upfront with people and said, you know, this plant might take me three months to get for you, but I will be able to get it. This is the pictures of the plants and people are really happy to wait for that plant that they've been searching so far for, for so long, especially if it's a good price to them because a lot of the plants that I do get can be very reasonably priced compared to the UK markets.

Jane Perrone

Yeah, that's interesting, isn't it? I guess there's also is this price differential between buying in the UK and overseas. This is that I think the big fear for a lot of people buying plants across international lines. What are the challenges in this realm? Have you got any advice for somebody who's maybe slipped up with this before and ended up losing their plants for weeks in customs? What are the problems and how do you tackle them?

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, so I think one of the most prevalent challenges when it comes to buying plants internationally is finding suppliers that are reliable and trustworthy. Unfortunately, there is like a high number of scammers in the plant world. I know there is in a lot of different industries, but especially when you're dealing with people internationally and you can't go and look at their collection - you're not sure what you're going to be getting. So I personally had to go through a lot of conversations. I actually lost quite a lot of money before I found the right international partners to work with me that I trusted to source the plants for myself and for my customers. And that's just kind of the process you have to go through. You might get lucky the first time you do it, but to tick all of the boxes that I wanted personally, it took me a very long time. You know, I think being able to get a partner or an international supplier that has all of the relevant paperwork is also very important. You mentioned customs. So for the UK, we have DEFRA, which is the Department of Environmental, Food, Rural Affairs, and they check every single package that comes through with plants in them. So if I have a package of 300 plants that come in, that's going to get opened, they're going to get to the very bottom of that, they're going to go through a quarter of those plants to make sure that they're healthy, they are what they said they are, they don't have any pests and disease. And that can be really, really worrying when you're looking at your delivery schedule and you're seeing that your plants still haven't passed through customs because you're waiting for death row.So I think one of the most important things and one of the biggest challenges is making sure that the paperwork is sorted on both ends. They've got their phytosanitary certificates, all of the plants have passed through, and then when it gets to your end, you can actually pay for an agent. So the agent will help make sure that everything is in order and your plants are gonna get through customs. You are gonna be in the loop with everything is going on and then they can be shipped to you.

[14:48] Music.

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Jane Perrone [16:13]

Back to my interview with Jasmine shortly, but now it's time for a soupçon of housekeeping. There's been some exciting news here at On the Ledge Towers, and that is that my book, Legends of the Leaf, has been shortlisted for an award, the Garden Book of the Year at the Garden Media Guild Awards. I'm up against four other fantastic titles, but I'm very excited to be in the running for this accolade, which is kind of the gardening equivalent of the Oscars. So very exciting. I'll find out in mid-November if I've won, and I'll obviously let you know what happens. Patreon news now, and I owe a shout out to Emilio who became a legend on a free trial so now you can join for seven days as a free trial and check out my offerings so for example if you joined as a free trial today you could hear an extra chunk of chat with my guest jasmine talking about how she got into rare plant scouting if after seven days you decide it's not for you no problem you can just cancel so it's risk-free definitely give it a whirl if you haven't tried my Patreon before. There is one other option that's new on Patreon and that's becoming a free member. So you pay absolutely nothing, but it means that I will be able to keep you in the loop about what I'm doing on the Patreon platform. And dozens of you have already taken up this opportunity. So do head across to my show notes at janeperrone.com to find out more or just Google Patreon On The Ledge and you'll find me. And finally, a quick shout out to The Other Dell, who left a five star review for the show. Thank you very much. Much appreciated.

Jane Perrone [18:07] What are the red flags that immediately when you're looking at potential suppliers, immediately send you scurrying away?

Jazminn Williams

So I think it's really important, and this is whether you're buying plants in the UK, in whatever country you're in, or internationally, you want to be asking for photos, and especially videos. So every single plant I buy from my international partners or if I'm trying to source a new supply, I will ask them for videos of that plant. And quite a lot of the suppliers, because they've been doing this for quite a long time, they understand the importance of making that person feel safe that they are buying the plant they're saying that they're going to get. So they will hold up a little name tag that says your name and the date on it next to the plant so you can go yes that's not just taken from somebody else. Another really important thing and this is probably one of the most important to make sure that you're not going to get scammed by people and that's to pay with PayPal goods and services for international payments. Now the supplier will get a fee for that, they won't get all of the money and that's something you have to talk to them about whether you add a little bit more to cover that but it It just means if something goes wrong, you can claim your money back in the situation. You know, if they don't send the plants, if they arrive and they're all really damaged and there's no way of kind of working out a solution, you are then covered and you're not losing hundreds or thousands of pounds.

Jane Perrone [19:29]

It's amazing how many people don't go down that route and just blithely do a bank transfer or use friends and family. It seems like a really obvious thing, but I'm guessing that there's lots of reasons why, on the other hand, the seller doesn't want the extra fees and then you've got to negotiate who's covering those fees.

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, exactly. I think a lot of the suppliers that I have are really good about that. We've spoken about it beforehand. I've said, this is a service that I'm going to use and we need to find a way of balancing this out so that I'm not incurring a massive charge and neither are you. So we usually meet in the middle and we work out that way, which is really nice. It means that you've got a good business partner there. If you're doing this long-term or for your personal collection, you want to know that the person that's supplying your plants is fair and they want to know that you're also fair.

Jane Perrone [20:17]

Is it still Southeast Asia that the majority of your business transactions are taking place from?

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, so I've been very fortunate to be in contact with quite a few people around the world. So Southeast Asia is predominantly where I get most of my aroids from, mainly because the two contacts I have out there have such a large expanse of space that they grow a lot of their plants themselves. And that kind of fits into my ethos of wanting to know where these plants are coming from. Also, I have supplies from America, and they do really specific plants. That's usually where I go, I want a 'Delta Force'. I will go to America because then you've got all of the certificates and paperwork from the origin of that plant. You can get that in Asia, but it's a lot easier if you go to the person who's created that plant. And Europe, actually, the Netherlands are a massive supply of plants, especially to the UK, they have huge greenhouses, which have a lot of of aroids in them. So that's something that I'm looking more to branch out on to try and prevent the amount of airfare and the amount of travel time of these plants.

Jane Perrone [21:26]

Yeah, yeah, that's the thing, isn't it? And have you ever actually visited in person any of these nurseries if you had the chance to do that?

Jazminn Williams

No, I personally haven't. I know a lot of people that do go out and they do go to these nurseries and it will be something that I do when I start to find more local European nurseries. But for the moment, I am doing everything kind of from my office. I find it a lot easier to spend the time looking after the plants here and being able to kind of find them overseas and bring them in than I do traveling to all of these places. I'm also trying to be very conscious with the amount of air miles I put in because all of my plants arrive to me via airmail. I don't want to then be also flying out to all of these places.

Jane Perrone

When you are looking at these plants, obviously we've talked a bit about, you know, ethical issues to do with plants, but obviously the other aspect of that is poaching that's going on in these plants' natural habitats. How do you tackle that issue and make sure that you're being as transparent as you can in terms of where the plants are coming from?

Jazminn Williams [22:29]

Yeah, honestly, it's really, really difficult. I have personally done a lot of research into my suppliers and the people that I want to be getting plants from. I predominantly get plants that have been grown from seeds or seedlings or cuttings from their own collection, which is why why I look for suppliers with large greenhouses. I've been very upfront about my intentions to have a business that is openly against plant poaching with my suppliers. And I've made sure that they're on the same wavelength as me when it comes to that, so that we're all trying to work towards not allowing that to happen. You know, the less plants you buy from plant poachers, the less they're gonna poach, hopefully. So they've been really good. My suppliers have been really good and they've backed my ethical stance. If they need to source a new plant, I'm very lucky. I get video calls, I get videos, I get photos of where they're going, which markets they're going to, which areas they're going to, where they've got the plants from, so I can look into it. And paperwork, having a paper trail on where that plant has been, it's not just the UK that requires plants to have plant passports, it's actually in quite a few countries. So making sure that you see that paperwork, you ask the questions. I think you really have to be a little bit up front with people and say, do you know where this has come from? I am not buying this from you, if you're not aware of where this has come from, has it come from here? Because asking those questions is really gonna help prevent those plants from being poached.

Jane Perrone

Are your clients concerned about this stuff? Or is it something where you have to educate the clients and say, yes, your friend might have been able to get this plant from somewhere, but actually, I haven't been able to source this plant because it's not currently available from a supplier that I would trust and so on.

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, so I've actually had a conversation with a long-term customer of mine quite recently who bought a plant from another supplier and I had to kind of say all of those plants are great apart from this one, that's a plant that I've not been able to source, I've been looking for for a really long time, there's been a lot of news about that, particular plant being ripped out of this area. So I was like, you know, it might not be something that you think about because you really want this beautiful plant, but you really need to be aware about where your plants are coming from. And I don't think many people think about it. It's kind of the, you know, head in the sand. We're not around it. It's not something that's on the news all the time. You really have to look and search to even know that plant poaching is a thing. I think a lot of people aren't even aware of it. It's not as big as animal poaching. It's not as out there the information isn't readily available. So I think I try and tell as many people as possible. I let people know where my plants have come from. On my website very soon there's going to be an entire page dedicated to plant poaching so that people can get information easily.

Jane Perrone

Help out listeners here because I know that I have so many listeners who get plants, some of them ordered from overseas, and have that deeply disappointing experience of either the plant turning up and being quite well bashed already, or it turns up looking great but very quickly deteriorates. This process of acclimation... I think it's something that would be really useful to get some tips about. So what can you offer up for how do you make sure these plants get off to a good start?

Jazminn Williams

It starts off with where you get your plants from. So if you're going to get plants locally, so for me within the UK is what I would call local to me, I like to give my plants an overall check for their health. So when they arrive, check for pests. I check for root rot, which a lot of people don't think about doing. And if it passes all those checks, then I can, you know, put it in my cabinet for a week or two, keep an eye on it, keep it away from my other plants. If it doesn't pass those checks you need to be communicating with your seller and going this plant has arrived with root rot, I'm going to either send it back for a refund, send it back for another plant or I can deal with this myself. So you know in the terms of pests or root rot you would wipe your leaves down, you would trim the roots and you would keep a very close eye on that plant. You also want to keep it in a well-ventilated area to give it the best chance of acclimating, you want to have fans, a constant steady temperature, humidity, I sit mine around 20 degrees and a 65% humidity for plants I'm acclimating and that should give you the best possible chance of a plant being able to thrive. If it arrives and it's in really bad condition, that's a conversation you need to have with a seller and I think a lot of people need to be really confident when you're talking to someone about plants that they've sent. If they have accidentally done it then they'll be more than happy to help you and this is why again, paying with goods and services is so important in case you do have a bad experience. For the international shipments, plants usually arrive bare root, so they arrive without any substrate on their root, potentially just wrapped in a little bit of moss to keep their roots from drying out during transit. So for me personally, I soak my plants, soak their roots for two days, one to two days in room temperature water, and then I repeat the process that I do with my locally sourced plants, and I usually give those about a three to four week acclimation process opposed to like maybe a week. And then I'll look at what I want to do with them from there.

Jane Perrone [27:39]

When you say root rot, can you just describe for listeners what that actually means?

Jazminn Williams

So there are different levels of root rot. When you're looking at the roots of a plant, you want them to be quite plump and thick and happy. If the plant's roots start getting really stringy on the end, or if they're really dried out and you touch it and it breaks off and there's just a really stringy bit, you need to chop that off, that's root rot. Another area of root rot is when roots become black and squishy so you do have to go through and kind of feel the roots, they can go a light to dark brown colour and smell test as well if you can, you want to smell it and if it smells a little bit mouldy, a little bit musty then you need to really check those roots, it might just be the substrate that they were in but it could be that they've started to deteriorate and you need to get in and chop some of them off.

Jane Perrone

Yeah and I guess the sooner you get onto that the better really because it's only going to get worse if you leave it.

Jazminn Williams

100% and And it can really, really dramatically change the health of a plant so quickly. You know, that's their source of nutrients, their source of water. If they haven't got a strong root system that they can continue growing with, very quickly you're going to see the leaves start browning, going yellow, drooping. And that's, I think, a massive issue with a lot of plants is we don't tend to get in that soil, check those roots and we're wondering why they look so unhappy on the surface.

Jane Perrone

I see a lot of people who buy plants on social media and then it goes wrong and they can't get anything out of the seller so they go on social media and have a good rant. What would you advise people in this situation though if it happens that you buy something on Facebook or similar and you don't get your plant or it's not in the right condition? I think there are definitely better ways of dealing with it.

Jazminn Williams [29:22]

So it is always good to make people aware if you have a seller who is selling bad plants, but it's not usually a good idea to publicly out people unless you have all of the information. So a lot of the plant groups, especially on Facebook, are fantastic. They have admins and moderators that are there to help. So I know that you can go to a lot of these admins and moderators on 90, 99% of these groups and say, I have this issue with this seller. This is what's happened. Can I give you the information? You help me resolve this issue. I personally can't and I've tried all of these things and quite often they'll act as a middleman, as a moderator and they will help to get a resolution for that problem. I do know that sometimes that doesn't work. And I have seen instances of people have posted their experiences, but not shared the individual that they've been bought off of, and it's been resolved. I think you do have to be very careful when you're outing people in case, you know, if you don't have both sides of the story, it's really hard to have a full picture of what's happening. So I think reaching out to people is the first step.

Jane Perrone

Is there an argument, say when you start off building a relationship with somebody you're going to be buying plants from, particularly overseas? Is it wise to just like dip your toe and just make a really small order, even if it costs you relatively a lot in terms of the admin costs and so on, just so that you can kind of like, okay, yeah, this person sent me this one plant and it's okay. So now I can go ahead and order that massive, you know, order that I want to do.

Jazminn Williams

Yes, a hundred percent. So from speaking from personal experience, every supplier that I have now got a partnership with, I bought a small order to start off to see what their paperwork was like, what their reply time, their communications, if something did arrive and it wasn't happy, how they personally dealt with it. And I think it's really important to test out a couple of different types of plants, a couple of different species, so you can see how they ship, especially with that individual. I think just doing a couple of small orders is a good idea because you don't know what's going to happen over time. You don't know whether they're sourcing their plants from somewhere else. And I think actually a very good point is if you have a seller who is buying plants from somebody else to sell to you, you need to be wary because that plant is being shipped from an individual to them, which is creating stress, and then from them to you, which is creating extra stress. So the likelihood of that plant being in tip-top condition is quite unlikely.

Jane Perrone

Do you see British growers starting to enter this market and challenge the South East Asian growers for a slice of the plant pie?

Jazminn Williams

Yeah, so I think that there are a lot of established companies coming out of the UK now. They're obviously still sourcing their plants from overseas and then growing them on here. So I think we are starting to get quite a good community of good established companies to buy from here. I think because of the tissue culture and everything that's happening around that, a lot of plants are now coming out of Europe, opposed to coming out of Asia. And I think because it's not as far to ship, the climates are quite similar in quite a lot of the places. There's a lot less stress on plants. I think a lot of people are kind of swaying more towards that than they are to Asia. But we'll have to see how it progresses as time goes on and how these companies within the UK start to grow and how prevalent they become in the industry.

Jane Perrone

Well, thanks so much for joining me, Jazminn. That's been a really fascinating insight into this world of plant hunting and I wish you luck with all of your work and I'll be fascinated to see what's coming next on the rare plant scene.

Jazminn Williams

Perfect, thank you so much Jane, you have a great day.

[33:14] Music.

Jane Perrone [33:22]

Thanks to Jazminn and do go and check out her website rareplantscout.co.uk and if you go to my show notes at janeperrone.com, you'll find a full transcript of the interview plus some other useful links. Now it's time for question of the week, and this one came from TikTok. Yes, TikTok. And you'll find me there under the same username as Instagram, j.l.perrone, if you want to get in touch. This one came from Palmtree Pam, who has a coconut palm that has turned brown. Several leaves are crisp. It's been watered and moved to the window, but Pam wants to know how to save it. So this is Cocos nucifera, the coconut palm. And I said at the intro to this podcast that it was one of the world's worst houseplants. And I stand by that statement. Do not buy a Cocos nucifera. Don't do it. Save yourself the money and the heartache. I maybe should give one small caveat and that is if you live somewhere where Cocos nucifera either grows in the wild or has been naturalised, so we're talking about tropical places basically, places like the Philippines and some parts of Australia, yeah go ahead have one outside, fantastic, but this does not make a good houseplant because it requires extremely high light levels and warmth and humidity that you probably most likely are not going to be able to offer in your home. I don't know why it's sold as a houseplant. I think that like a lot of plants they just think well it'll last a few months and then it'll die and people will deal with it but it just doesn't make a really good specimen for indoors. Yes, it looks really beautiful. This is indeed the palm that coconuts come from. So if you, but you're not going to get any coconuts indoors, even if you do keep it alive.

Jane Perrone [35:23]

And you really are letting yourself in for a lot of disappointment. When you buy one of these, it just looks like a coconut half poked out of the soil with these gorgeous big palmy leaves coming out of it. And these aren't cheap to buy either. I think they're retailing currently in the UK for something around the £50 mark. I do know Ikea sell them for a lot less than that. But you know, I would urge you just to buy a different palm. There are so many good palms that will work really well in houses. For example, Kentia palm, Howea forsteriana, an Areca palm, Chrysalidocarpus lutescens, or a Parlour palm Chamaedorea elegans, a lady palm, Rhapis excelsa. I'm throwing out palm names here. These are all moderate to easy in a normal house. Not so much Cocos, Nucifera. It really isn't going to work. So if you've got one, what's the best case scenario? Well, in the case of Pam's palm, the best thing to do is to maximize light levels, gradually increase light levels until it's in front of your biggest sunniest window. Ideally supplement that with a grow light, give it heck tons of heat and make sure it's in humid air and cross your fingers, it won't last probably more than a couple of years but you may be able to maximise its lifespan. It's a disappointing thing that plants that just aren't really suitable for growing indoors are marketed that way. There are a few other plants that fit into this category, in my opinion anyway. One of them is Medinilla magnifica. Again, unless you've got a really beautifully warm, sunny conservatory where you can keep that heat pumping out and give the plant loads of light, it's a tricky one. And I'm probably also going to put Aphelandra into that category. The Zebra plant, plant, Aphelandra squarrosa, again, you never really see an old one of those plants in a house just because they just don't make it that long. So steer clear of plants that aren't going to give you a long term relationship because that's not very sustainable or green. So yeah, it's disappointing. But I hope you can bear with that news, Pam, and get the best out of your plant while it's still alive. But don't buy another one. Buy a different kind of palm. And if you've got a question for On The Ledge, why not drop me a line ontheledgepodcast@gmail.com is the best way to get in touch.

[38:03] Music.

Jane Perrone [38:09]

That's all for this week's show. I do hope you and your plants have a really lovely week, whether you're chopping and propping, or simply giving a leaf a stroke. Bye!

[38:21] Music.

Jane Perrone [38:34]

The music you heard in this episode was Roll Jordan Roll by The Joy Drops.The Road We Used To Travel When We Were Kids by Komiku, and Whistle by Benjamin Banger. All tracks are licensed under Creative Commons. Visit the show notes for details.

[38:50] Music.

I chat to Jazminn WIlliams aka The Rare Plant Scout about tracking down people’s precious wishlist plants, how to buy safely from overseas sellers, and how to make sure your plants arribe in great shape. Plus I answer a question about one of the world’s worst houseplants!

This week’s guest

Jazminn Williams is the owner and founder of The Rare Plant Scout, helping clients find hard-to-source houseplants from around the world. She is on Insta as @therareplantscout.

Chapters

0:00:33 News about Houseplant Gardener in a Box, out now in the UK
0:02:22 Interview with Jasmine Williams, the Rare PLant Scout
0:13:50 Importance of roper paperwork for customs Clearance
0:17:18 Patreon updates: free trial and free membership
0:18:07 Part two of my interview with Jazminn WIlliams, looking at how to avoid red flags when buying plants from overseas
0:22:28 Tackling plant poaching and ensuring transparency in sourcing plants
0:35:23 Q&A - Why Cocos nucifera is not a good houseplant
0:38:33 Music credits

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Order your copy now! It’s now out in the UK in all good bookshops and will be released in the US via Abrams Books on October 24 2023.

Houseplant Gardener in a Box is now out in the UK, and published in the US on October 24 2023

Grow happy, healthy houseplants with the help of these simple, illustrated cards. The 60 informative cards, illustrated by artist Cody Bond, and 32-page book packaged in a giftable box.

I answer hundreds of questions, including: What sort of plants love a bathroom? How can you bring an orchid back into flower? What needs regular watering, and what doesn’t mind if you forget? What can you put on a sunny windowsill, and what will send foliage tumbling attractively from a shelf? Drawing on years of experience and research, her cards provide sensible, practical, and inspiring advice. The accompanying book will guide you through the process of selecting plants, and Cody Bond’s beautiful illustrations will inspire you along the way. Order your copy now from all good bookstores (and lots of plant shops too!)

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Question of the week

While the coconut palm is a wonderful plant, it does not make a great houseplant. Photograph: Joan Simon on Flickr.

This question came from Palmtree Pam, who has a coconut palm (Cocos nucifera) that has turned brown and several leaves are crisp. It's been watered and moved to the window. Can it be saved?

As the common name suggests, this is the species from which coconuts grow. The short answer is in the long term, no. In the intro to this podcast I described it as one of the world's worst houseplants, and it is a species I would strongly advise against buying for growing inside.

It grows in tropical climes so Cocos nucifera needs a huge amount of light, heat and humidity - things that are hard to provide indoors, especially light. Bear in mind that you're not going to get any coconuts indoors, even if you do keep it alive. It won’t grow for a long time indoors, which doesn’t make it a particularly sustainable choice of plant. To keep a coconut palm alive for as long as possible, maximise light levels, ideally supplementing natural light with a grow light, give it heck tons of heat and make sure it's in humid air and cross your fingers.

There are so many good palms that will work much better in houses. For example, Kentia palm, Howea forsteriana, an Areca palm, Chrysalidocarpus lutescens, or a parlour palm Chamaedorea elegans, a lady palm, Rhapis excelsa. Other species I’d put into this impossible to grow long term’ category are Medinilla magnifica and the zebra plant, plant, Aphelandra squarrosa.

Want to ask me a question? Email ontheledgepodcast@gmail.com. The more information you can include, the better - pictures of your plant, details of your location and how long you have had the plant are always useful to help solve your issue.

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This week’s sponsor

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HOW TO SUPPORT ON THE LEDGE

Contributions from On The Ledge listeners help to pay for all the things that have made the show possible over the last few years: equipment, travel expenses, editing, admin support and transcription.

Want to make a one-off donation? You can do that through my ko-fi.com page, or via Paypal.

Want to make a regular donation? Join the On The Ledge community on Patreon! Whether you can only spare a dollar or a pound, or want to make a bigger commitment, there’s something for you: see all the tiers and sign up for Patreon here.

NEW! You can now join my Patreon as a free member or take out a seven-day free trial of my Ledge End tier. Visit my Patreon page for details.

• The Crazy Plant Person tier just gives you a warm fuzzy feeling of supporting the show you love.

• The Ledge End tier gives you access to one extra episode a month, known as An Extra Leaf, as well as ad-free versions of the main podcast and access to occasional patron-only Zoom sessions.

• My Superfan tier earns you a personal greeting from me in the mail including a limited edition postcard, as well as ad-free episodes.

If you like the idea of supporting On The Ledge on a regular basis but don't know what Patreon's all about, check out the FAQ here: if you still have questions, leave a comment or email me - ontheledgepodcast@gmail.com. If you're already supporting others via Patreon, just click here to set up your rewards!

If you prefer to support the show in other ways, please do go and rate and review On The Ledge on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher or wherever you listen. It's lovely to read your kind comments, and it really helps new listeners to find the show. You can also tweet or post about the show on social media - use #OnTheLedgePodcast so I’ll pick up on it!

CREDITS

This week's show featured the tracks Roll Jordan Roll by the Joy Drops, The Road We Use To Travel When We Were Kids by Komiku and Whistle by BenJamin Banger (@benjaminbanger on Insta; website benjaminbanger.com).